Data Lost [Feb 26, 2017] Squally's Sunday Skirmishes - Halo 5 (XONE)

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N3gat1veZer0

Proficient
Jan 18, 2016
40
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Resolute if there is an open spot, If there is a map that actually needs tested put it in first. I want to test specifically for framerate problems and if so, listen to any suggestions.
 
Apr 23, 2013
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Resolute:
At this point, the map feels pretty solid in my opinion, so there isn't much I have to say about it. The spawns in Strongholds need work, obviously, and I also felt the stronghold in bottom mid was a bit awkward to both control and fight in.

Praetor:

I think the bottom of the map could use a bit more cover from the top areas. Every time I went down there I felt way too exposed to players on the upper catwalks, and especially players coming from the OS spawn.

Belligerent:

There are a lot of dead clamber spots around the map that need to be addressed. Some players said that the pacing was a bit slow, but I didn't have an issue with it. There are also some spots near the flag in CTF where players can easily camp and take out anyone going for their flag, which I felt was a bit frustrating to deal with.

You may also want to experiment with the Scattershot by only putting one on the map in a neutral location somewhere, as those weapons got a lot of play.

Divine Fury:

I think this map is in a pretty rough state currently. The sniper tower felt very awkward to fight in, which was made worse by the fact the Beam Rifle spawns there. The cave area could use more cover in some spots, as fights would end up with players chasing each other in circles.

Stronghold placement could also use some work. Relic and Cave were the clear points to hold, as they had an almost direct line of sight between each other and the third stronghold (can't remember the name) was too disconnected from the other two.
 
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Squally DaBeanz

Big Jerk
Jan 9, 2013
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Resolute by N3gat1veZer0
The map is playing as well as ever. Performance issues throughout the map are obviously an issue, but there's not much that can be done about that at this point. I think most of the complaints during Strongholds had to do with some rough team imbalances as well as learning curve difficulties with how the map plays. Personally, I don't think the strongholds setup is a problem as it is. As was discussed in the lobby, maybe slight tweaks to some sightlines into bottom mid from the second level of the map could alleviate some of the issues, but it's not a major problem.

I did come to a realization while watching the Slayer film, however. The third level on red side is much harder to attack and flush people out of than the blue side. This is due to the fact that there is an entrance in the middle of the path that allows players to dip out of a losing fight. Blue side does not have an equivalent option. It may be worth looking into possibly adding a window on the rock ledge that looks down into blue room. Obviously, the logistics of such a change would have to be taken into account, and it may not be a viable option. Still something to think about though.

Praetor by The Darkk Skull
Considering that this map is still fairly early in its testing phase, it's doing quite well overall (aside from the CTF spawning hiccup). Most of the required changes are small tweaks to geometry, and cleaning up messy construction. Most of these changes have already been discussed with you in detail and I know you've already started addressing most of them, so I'll be writing them here more for record keeping than anything else. The bases and the surrounding areas still feel slightly claustrophobic and maze-like. There are two major factors contributing to this. One is the cramped nature of the backs of each base and the other is the shape and size of the pillar in the junction in front of each base. Expanding on the hallways in the back of each base, as well as removing the small trapezoid on the floor by the flag, will allow players to more easily move during combat in these areas. Replacing the pillar in the junction with a simpler shape will allow players to better read the available paths, as the current shape implies that the paths are more binary than they actually are.

Adding terrain ramps from the lower cliffs leading up to each bridge will give players on the lower levels more vertical movement options while still keeping flag runs through the bottom difficult. This will also require the current design of the bridge railings to be changed slightly to properly inform players that there is an intentional path there. Other spaces that could use some tweaks for the sake of readability are the doorways and paths leading to the man cannons and ledges overlooking green. Currently, these areas feel very much cut off from the rest of the map due to their small doorways and how far away they are from the main "window" on either side of gold. Simply enlarging the doorway to this area, as well as the ramp up to each overlook, would help reframe this space and catch players eyes better. Another tweak worth considering is lowering the trapezoids that act as "railings" in top gold to allow players at a lower elevation to better combat players holding top gold.

Finally, several areas of the map could benefit from cleaner construction. Green is the biggest offender at this point, as it is overly complicated with lots of unplayable geometry that doesn't fit the simplicity of the rest of the map. Some of the railings and pillars in bottom mid could benefit from a rebuild as well since there are several gaps and awkward connections between pieces. The same thing can be seen in the trim lining the roof of the big windows on either side of gold. The small ledges above bottom gold that overlook bottom mid need pieces covering the underside of them, as excess geometry and terrain can be seen.

Epirus by The Grim Dealer
The small changes made to the map since last week are working very well. The new platform in Long Hall is a nice counter larger platform leading to the mid catwalk, and blue courtyard feels a lot more comfortably scaled. The tweaks to the Stronghold placement worked wonders. No longer is holding Blue Ledge and Long Hall the only viable option. Any combination of holds are equally viable, and there are several adjacent areas to each stronghold that allow players to put pressure on two at a time without ever having total control over them. My only two complaints are the ugly new pipe wall added to Blue Ledge, and the unfortunate spawn kill I got while sniping from Red Nest. Aside from that, I don't have much else to say. Keep playing it and polishing any minor problems you may see.

Belligerent by Partarar
Having played this map in the past and already helping with some earlier changes, there's very little I have to say about the layout of the map itself. Most of the issues voiced by myself and other players were several dead clambers around the map, making things unnecessarily difficult in many cases. I would go through the entire map and test every possible clamber point. If shifting blocks won't fix the problem, then try adding an invisible blocker over the corners to allow clambers to happen. The other major complaint that was agreed upon was the campability of the bases. The small ledges next to each flag with the vent looking pillars (also dead clambers) provided far too much cover for anyone guarding their flag, and is not visible from any effective power position on the map. I feel removing the pillars in these areas and removing the railings on the side next to the stairs will greatly reduce the ability to camp directly on the flag and force players to lock down the approaches to their base from other areas of the map.

The space directly under the bridges leading into each base still feel slightly awkward as well. Players coming from their own teams lower yard have to make a complete U turn to clamber up the platform there, then have to turn again to get on the bridge, then turn again to effectively combat anyone in the base. This much unnecessary movement hurts the flow of players, and makes that path less desirable than others and difficult to use. I suggest expanding the length and reducing the width of the platform, and removing the glass barrier near the back corner of each base. This would allow players to approach the initial clamber from a more comfortable angle, and provide them with a second option once on the platform. The removal of the glass barrier will also help reduce camping in the base itself and force players to push out to defend their base.

Divine Fury by Mr Deliciousman
I had looked at this map in forge previously, but had never played on it before. After playing on it, however, I was disappointed. The map seems very solid from a conceptual viewpoint, but I feel there are many factors currently holding it back. For starters, the map seems to lack a focus on positioning. There are many unintuitive angles and corners for players to camp in, and there are no areas on the map that I ever felt I absolutely had to lock down in order to win. The only two areas that ever came close are the top mid ledge and the sniper tower These two positions counter each other, but never have much power over any other positions on the map aside from what was directly below them. To add to this, the sniper tower itself feels very awkward to play in. The surrounding areas of the map feel random and without focus. There are several redundant routes, none of which lead anywhere except to more routes. The cave areas is particularly problematic, as the overabundance of pillars leads to a lot of fights boiling down to players running in circles until a teammate comes to break things up. The same can be said for the parallel staircases leading down to the "Relic" stronghold area. These two staircases accomplish the exact same thing, and make the entire upper back area of the map feel like a forced addition to the layout. Many other routes feel forced as well, such as the awkwardly shaped ramps leading to the upper areas of the middle room and the paths cutting under the platform immediately next to the sniper tower.

The stronghold placement on the map left something to be desired as well. The clear choice to hold was cave and relic, since there was a nearly direct line between the two, and they were both in sight of the only two high points of the map. The third stronghold acted as a spawn trap for the other team, and it was difficult for them to push out due to the lack of other powerful positions on the map.
 
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CDX34

Master
Mar 23, 2015
62
24
108
Feedback for 1/22/17

Resolute - In Slayer, this map is amazing, though I will say that gameplay seemed a bit too focused on ambushing the other team, rather than any sort of direct engagements, but that could've just been the players at the time, I haven't had enough experience with this map to really tell. Strongholds is where what few (and minor) flaws were really brought to light. The first thing I noticed was just how close Blue team's starting spawns are to the Fuel Rod Cannon, since there's already a path around Bottom Mid that way, I would suggest simply moving the weapon pad more towards the center of that path. The other thing I noticed was just how much grenades were thrown in and out of Bottom Mid. Again, maybe it was just a player thing, but it really felt like the clear best way to keep players out of that stronghold was to nade the crap out of it. All that said, the map flows very well, no one spot feels safe to camp in, and the power weapons compliment the map well. Not to mention how good it looks.

Praetor - So this is supposed to be a Guardian map right? Lol
Jokes aside, the flaw of this map, for Me at least, was just how awkward traversing it was. It felt like there were a lot of dead ends and odd corners. Speaking of dead ends, facing sniper spawn there were "ring" piece drop downs to gaps either side of Yellow Tower, players kept going to these areas from below, only to be met with a wall. Really feels like there should be lifts there, or at least something other than a dead end. And speaking of Yellow Tower, it seems like a very easy to control location, with whichever team was already there outnumbering and out-positioning anyone who tries to go there. In direct contrast to this, OS spawn was almost always a 1v1 area, as there's only a few ways to get there, and the flow of the map mostly puts that area well out of the way. There's one other major issue though, and that's in CTF. The spawns aren't static! You got Blue team literally spawning at Red team's flag and vice versa.

Epirus - The area named "Long Hall" is a spawn trap, so much so, that I can't really say anything about the rest of the map. It's not as bad in Strongholds because of how the gametype works, but it's still a major issue.

Belligerent - The Plasma Caster and Scattershot work well on this map... Maybe a bit too well. While I wouldn't recommend getting rid of them, I'd say play around with spawn times, and possibly the idea of replacing the Plasma Caster with a neutral Scattershot and just seeing how that changes things. Another thing that was quite apparent, was just how many obvious clamber spots didn't actually work. It feels like if the according platforms were raised/lowered by a literal hair, they would work as they were presumably meant to. Do note however, that fixing this would drastically increase the speed of the game. The only other criticism I have is that I personally found it a bit hard to tell which side of the map I was on, especially in the areas of the bottom floor. I actually really liked this map though. It's visually appealing, movement flows quite well despite the broken jump ups, and the lines of sight felt good, not too long or open, but not narrow or cluttered either.

Divine Fury - The sniper tower and to a lesser extent the immediate surrounding area is easily the most heavily contested part of the map, with the rest of the map seeing little to no action. Partially do to the movement flow of the map, and partially do to the lack of appeal of the "Garden" area. It's an open area with not much going on, the lines of sight from inside this area are limited and mostly seclude it from the rest of the map. This problem is even more apparent in Strongholds, where the other Strongholds (Cave and Relic) have a direct line of sight into each other, and Relic specifically being very easy to hold by camping, creating a "best pair to hold" situation, leaving the Garden Stronghold without much use or value. The map looks great though, the amount of detail on the sniper tower and that giant Elite head is amazing!
 
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Squally DaBeanz

Big Jerk
Jan 9, 2013
342
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Map lineup for 1/29/17:

SaltyKoalaBear - Port 66 - Slayer/Strongholds
Partarar - Bulwark - Slayer/CTF
Given To Fly 93 - Highguard - Slayer/Strongholds
The Darkk Skull - Praetor - Slayer/CTF
The Grim Dealer - Epirus - Slayer/Strongholds

Backup Maps:
MartianMallCop - Pueblo - Slayer/Strongholds
STUNT ARTIST - Waist High - Slayer/Strongholds

Continue to signup below!
 
Last edited:
Apr 23, 2013
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Slayer/Strongholds on Epirus

If these new changes work as well as I hope, then I think I'll be releasing the map pretty soon.

- Removed OS
- Sniper now spawns in bottom mid
- Rockets now spawn in junction
- Restricted sightlines to improve spawn quality/survivability in some areas
- Moved/removed troublesome spawns and added a few new ones around the map
 
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Squally DaBeanz

Big Jerk
Jan 9, 2013
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Maps played on 1/29/17:

Port 66 by SaltyKoalaBear (For Chub)
Bulwark by Partarar
Highguard by Given To Fly 93
Praetor by The Darkk Skull
Epirus by The Grim Dealer
Waist High by STUNT ARTIST
Pueblo by MartianMallCop

Please leave any feedback you have for the maps you played. I will be posting mine sometime this week.
 

Squally DaBeanz

Big Jerk
Jan 9, 2013
342
217
126
Hey guys, sorry I wasn't able to post feedback this week. Things have been really hectic, and I never got the chance. However, most of the authors received some form of feedback on their maps regardless, either from me or from others involved with testing. I'll still try to host a lobby tonight, but we'll see how many people end up coming.
 

Squally DaBeanz

Big Jerk
Jan 9, 2013
342
217
126
Well, since everyone was gone watching some "superb owl" and other such avian creatures, the lobby was unfortunately a bust (my fault for hosting during sportsball). Because of this, the map lineup will be pushed to next week, so continue to signup below!
 

Unfound

Novice
Feb 8, 2017
2
1
3
Hey so I'd like to submit a map for your next session:

GT: Unfound
Map: Thelios
Gametype: Slayer/Strongholds
Link

Thanks, I'll try to attend If i can.
 
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Feb 25, 2016
15
9
3
32
Pennsylvania
For your next lobby
GT: OverlordRaven91

Map: Gypsum

Gametype: Slayer or strongholds, whichever the lobby prefers

Players: 4v4

Descriptions: Vast crystal cave theme with long sight lines, many clamber jumps and corridors
 
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