Data Lost [Feb 26, 2017] Squally's Sunday Skirmishes - Halo 5 (XONE)

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N3gat1veZer0

Proficient
Jan 18, 2016
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Scorch Palace
I had no beef with the map. Teams could easily set up any two strongholds. There wasn't one that was too easy or hard to cap

Aerie
I can't think of any suggestions or improvements other than spawns. I was never spawn killed, but the outside areas are really cramped and hard to menuveur. Anything else is beyond my scope of knowledge

ODA-241
I like junction stronhold, but red and blue bridge can stand to move. Blue can be very hard to take because its open to the entire map from the front, and i saw a lot of people holding out between junction and blue bridge (including myself) that made taking it very difficult. Bottom mid was unusable. I like the idea of adding a bridge between junction window and long hall window. Also a tier 3 weapon would be nice, preferably a rocket.

Resolute
getting rid of railgun. no one can stop me
something i just thought of:
bottom stonghold is kind of bowl shaped. Im going to try flipping the bowl around to try and deflect grenades so hopefully it wont seem so grenade happy down there

Echelon
the layout itself was a good size and the rooms as well, but the bridges, walkways, and halls were hard to fight in if you were caught in/on them
 
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Apr 23, 2013
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The reception for ODA has been interesting. People either love or hate the map, depending on who you ask. Regardless, I do agree that some sightlines could be restricted some more, but as far as everything else is concerned, I have a lot of consideration to do.
 
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Squally DaBeanz

Big Jerk
Jan 9, 2013
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Maps played on 9/18/16:

Mr Deliciousman - Scorch Palace
Flying Shoe ILR - Aerie
The Grim Dealer - ODA-241
N3gat1veZer0 - Resolute
Squally DaBeanz - Echelon
MartianMallCop - Spillway

Please leave any feedback you have for the maps you played. I will be posting mine at some point this week. In the meantime, you can catch up on the maps played and the feedback given during the lobbies via the Twitch stream:

Warning: Major lag spikes disrupted the video on several occasions.

 

Squally DaBeanz

Big Jerk
Jan 9, 2013
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Due to a new job and work schedule, this lobby will have to go on hiatus for a while. Until I can sort out a more regular schedule that doesn't involve Sunday evening, all map testing will have to be put on hold. I will let everyone know when I can start the lobby back up again.
 

Squally DaBeanz

Big Jerk
Jan 9, 2013
342
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scaptainb.jpg

Are you ready to test some maps!?!?

Squally's Sunday Skirmishes will be starting again next week, January 15th 2017! To get back in the swing of things, I will be starting with testing 4V4 maps until further notice. There are already a few maps I have in mind to add to the testing lineup myself, but feel free to sign up your own maps too, as those will get priority testing slots. As this lobby has evolved over the months, the way I run things has changed slightly from the original post. Here is the basic rundown of how things will operate:

- The lobby will officially begin at 7:00 PST every Sunday evening.

- I will start sending invites up to 20 minutes beforehand.

- I am testing core maps only. Infection, Grifball, and other minigames will have to find a home elsewhere. (sorry)

- Each map in the lineup will be played twice in a row.

- You can reserve a testing slot for your map by responding to this thread with your gamertag, map name, and up to two gametypes you want it tested for (Slayer will usually be played first). A Waypoint link to your map or fileshare is encouraged.

- I will rarely be testing two maps from the same author, unless circumstances require it. This is to allow everyone who wishes to test a map to get a chance.

- If you are late or absent, your map will be pushed further down the lineup, to the end, or removed entirely (depending on the situation). Please let me know if you won't be there ASAP.

- Message me on XBL to receive an invite prior to the lobby start time. (Unless you're a regular. You know who you are.)

- The bulk of feedback for each map will be reserved for after the second playtest.

- YOU NEED A MIC!!! You can't coordinate with your team for an optimal gameplay experience or discuss feedback without one.

- These lobbies will be streaming on Twitch. As such, you must include your voice chat in the Twitch stream in order to document all feedback.
(I will find you if you don't!)

- After the lobby has finished, I encourage everyone to post feedback on the maps you played here in this thread. Written feedback after the fact can be much more in depth and valuable than spoken feedback immediately following a match.

- I will be uploading the Twitch stream to Youtube afterwards.

That about wraps it up!

Now...
297947_1.jpg
 
Apr 23, 2013
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Welcome back Squally!

Strongholds/Slayer on ODA-241 V2.

I've changed this map quite a bit since you last played it. I wanted to change the focus from cross-map engagements to more CQC oriented gameplay. The map has also been scaled down a lot from its original size, which was comparable to Torque, to a size closer to The Rig.
 
Apr 23, 2013
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What are the chances of you accepting two submissions from someone if the map playlist stays as small as it is currently (assuming you haven't accepted maps not posted in the thread)?
 

Squally DaBeanz

Big Jerk
Jan 9, 2013
342
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-Map played on 1/15/17-

Aerie
by Skyward Shoe
ODA-214 by The Grim Dealer
Silence by The Grim Dealer
Overhaul by METOUR
Contusion by Bromaniac35
Vessel by Chronmeister
Echelon Squally DaBeanz

Please leave any feedback you have for the maps you played. I will be posting mine at some point this week. In the meantime, you can catch up on the maps played and the feedback given during the lobbies via the Twitch stream:

(Pardon the lag spikes)
 
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Apr 23, 2013
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Aerie:
I think that Stronghold placement could use some work, mainly Blue Tunnel, as that one felt like it was a little too exposed. I also think that the map played a bit slow in Slayer, which could be due to the fact that the map is a bit on the larger side for 4v4s. If you were to decrease the scale slightly, that would speed up gameplay in Slayer and also help to reduce the likelihood of a spawn trap in Strongholds.

Overhaul:
Not much to say that wasn't already said about this one. It's definitely too big for a 4v4 map, so that should be the first thing to work on. After you've scaled it down, you should then work to make the map less flat, as it was just one giant floor with a few elevated platforms.

Contusion:
Some of the spawns were a bit disorienting. I wish I had more to say about this one, but I was only able to play one match before I had to leave. What I did play was pretty solid, though.
 

Squally DaBeanz

Big Jerk
Jan 9, 2013
342
217
126
-Feedback for 1/15/17-

Aerie by Skyward Shoe
Having played this map several times in the past, I've started to notice trends in player movement. Certain areas of the map are played in more often than others. The areas that see less traffic are the flanks around blue tunnel (bottom and side), the lower catwalk under the cargo container, and the terrain stretching from the bridge all the way around red tunnel. I believe these three areas suffer a combination of issues. The flanks around blue tunnel are very subtle, making it difficult for players to notice them. However, even when players do know they're there, the small amounts of dancefloor pushed against a sheer drop pose too much of a risk to use on a regular basis, creating standoff situations with blue tunnel. The catwalk under the cargo container suffers similar issues. The path is far too narrow and there are too many sightlines into it for players down there to effectively combat enemy players pursuing them.

The stretch of terrain all around red side feels too linear and disconnected from the rest of the map to have an impact on other areas. This disconnect make encounters here fully self contained, making the space feel pointless when fights are going on elsewhere. Because the size of the map overall is fine where it stands, I would recommend a redesign of this area that better connects it to other areas rather than simply adding more routes and flanks.

ODA-214 by The Grim Dealer
The recent (or maybe not so recent) overhaul to this map has worked wonders for it. The art and gameplay on here are leagues ahead of what they were last time I played it, and I think it's down to a final polish stage. As we discussed in the lobby, I think the long hall area where Rockets spawn and the lower courtyard by blue deck could benefit from having the walls pulled in slightly. Obviously, players will make use of the amount of playspace they need, but having tighter walls could help focus engagements in those areas. It could also help with spawning, as I noticed some of the spawns against those back walls being too heavily favored despite enemy players being in the same room/area.

Another thing that could use some work is stronghold locations. The current setup makes it too easy to lock down all three positions, as they are all visible and accessible from the top mid platform. Blue platform and long hall have direct lines of sight and are connected by a single straight pathway, whereas red room is a lot more separated from the other two and harder to travel to from either one, creating an obvious "best hold". Keep in mind that an ideal setup for strongholds places each stronghold in a recognizable and fun location equally distanced from each other around the map, with three adjacent areas between the points that each have power over the strongholds. The closer you can get to achieving such a setup, the better.

Silence by The Grim Dealer
As far as initial blockouts go this one isn't too bad, even if the design is pretty "safe." As you undoubtedly noticed, the Fuel Rod spawn was the most sought after position, as it is the highest point in the map and is easily able to control all approaches to it. Lowering the height of this area, as well as better connecting it to the surrounding structures could help reduce its power. The other area I had a major problem with was the giant trenches in front of each base. These are long flat stretches of space that span the distance of the map. Having such a sightline with few other options for cover or vertical movement nearby ensures that players will never travel in these areas, and that the long sightline will constantly be abused. If you could find a way to add some more angles to this path while still discouraging player to cross the middle during flag runs, the map will play better for it.

Speaking of flag runs, going through the middle was easily the most viable option. This is largely due to the fact that the middle structure has enough covered routes through it to encourage players to use it as the fastest safe route. Forcing players to expose themselves in a way that doesn't hurt the other functions of the structure will help make CTF games more interesting and strategic.

Overhaul by METOUR
This being your first map in Halo 5, it's clear that you got carried away with making things pretty and playing with the new toys. Unfortunately, there's not much worth saving on this map, as it boils down to a large flat box with a few elevated platforms around the edges and in the middle. It's the typical Midship formula, but with nothing new being added. I suggest you keep forging and playing with all the new tools and objects until you feel comfortable enough to start working on a blockout of a new design. In the meantime, do some research on the design pillars of Halo 5 maps. Things like movement speed, engagement distances, travel time, clambers, and pro jumps should all be taken into consideration before starting on a design.

Contusion by Bromaniac35
I was looking forward to playing this map, as I had only watched others play on it up until now. While the map is a solid design overall, I feel additional work needs to be done to the layout. As many people pointed out, the lower levels of the map currently feel useless. I believe this is due to the bottom being relatively flat and open, with no direct connections to upper areas or other structures. This is particularly problematic on the side opposite the tower, where there is a long elevated portion of floor that has jump ups on aither side leading up to their respective buildings. This over-abundance of jump-ups acting as the primary source of vertical movement can be seen throughout the map. Many areas on the bottom levels and around the tower rely too much on jumps, making players who are already at a height disadvantage have to take a strategically less viable route up to attack enemy players above them. This is particularly bad around the tower where sand bags, crates, and vents could easily be replaced with ramps and hallways.

As for the tower itself, it feels as if there is an excessive amount of ledges in and around that area, making player movement and positioning difficult to predict and encouraging a campy playstyle. The stronghold placement could also use some changing as well. As it stands, one team has quick access to two of the strongholds off of spawn, and those two are arguably the ideal hold for the map. The strongholds need to be more evenly spread around the map, allowing either team to capture two in a similar amount of time.

Vessel by Chronmeister
Considering that this map was originally designed as a 2V2, it worked surprisingly well for 4V4. However, the meta game quickly devolved into one team holding the top platform while the other team tries to push up from various locations around the map. This is most likely because the top level spans a majority of the length of the map, and can easily catch glimpses of each area surrounding it. There are several options as to how you can fix this. One would be to lower the entire platform and see how the other areas around the map can then put pressure on the top. Another option would be to change the shape of the top platform. This could lead to a totally different gameplay experience, one which doesn't involve grenade spam by the teleporter exit. A third option would be to split the top level into separate areas. This would create fights between the two upper areas, and force players to move down into other areas of the map in order to flank the opposing position.

Another complaint I heard was that some of the lower areas felt like dead ends, and players would often become trapped with no clear escape routes. There are two spots I can think of that fit this description. The first is the small opening directly under the top bridge. This space is accessible from only one side, but it's the side that has other various vertical movement options. The pit it overlooks can easily become a death trap. Perhaps lowering or redesigning this hole to allow access from both sides can alleviate this problem, and may work in favor of redesigning the top to be two separate areas. The other space I can think of that can feel like a dead end is the corner where the teleporter entrance is located. It might be worth looking into removing the teleporter entirely as having a way to immediately be on the top of the map only adds to the chaos there. Without the teleporter demanding a designated space, you could experiment with other routes and vertical movement options in that corner.



Thanks to everyone who submitted maps and/or played on them. Next week will be another 4V4 lobby, so don't forget to sign up! If the authors of this week's maps have any questions regarding the feedback, feel free to message me here or on XBL. I hope to see you all Sunday!
 
Apr 23, 2013
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Slayer/Strongholds on Epirus (formerly Heights/ODA-241)

- Scaled down Blue Courtyard to make interactions in the area a bit tighter as well as close some sightlines
- Added a raised platform in Long Hall to close up the bottom level of the room a bit as well as add a new control point to the area
- Changed Stronghold locations to Red Elbow, Blue Courtyard, and Junction
- Removed Active Camo
- Interactive door at Junction will now always be open for Strongholds
 
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